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the Brainless beating Barbie thread

Moderator:  fallingstar

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Re: Brainless beating Barbie (hardest 1v1)

Postby  Brainless » Thu May 01, 2014 9:07 pm

OK now... all installed and tested:

Brainless vs Barbie 2.14b hardest
AOC UP 1.4
1v1, map Sea Haven, explored

comment: no interesting game at all. I always experience the sea element in maps like this as an obstacle for dynamic gameplay.
Barbarian obviously is too agressive, it thinks its too strong and attacks itself to death. It should adapt to a well defended situation.
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Attachment: Brainless vs Barbie - Hardest 1v1 SeaHaven.mgz.zip
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Re: Brainless beating Barbie (hardest 1v1)

Postby  TheMax » Thu May 01, 2014 10:03 pm

Barbarian does not have code to take sea towers and that monk ship into account, which led to excessive aggressiveness early. There also seemed to be some bug that prevented retreating against the castle, I'll have to take a look at that. Attacking, and especially not retreating, without proper cannon galleon/transport support looked bad.

The map isn't very AI-friendly though, since the hills will prevent placing additional town centers (which were required for more docks) and it'd require a very complicated code to migrate to other islands without knowing their exact location. Barbarian burned the wood out pretty fast.

Thanks.
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Re: Brainless beating Barbie (hardest 1v1)

Postby  Brainless » Thu May 01, 2014 10:20 pm

  01 May 2014, 21:03 GMT » TheMax wrote:
The map isn't very AI-friendly though, since the hills will prevent placing additional town centers (which were required for more docks) and it'd require a very complicated code to migrate to other islands without knowing their exact location. Barbarian burned the wood out pretty fast.

Thanks.


It wasnt friendly for me either, but i decided i did not need a 2nd TC that hard if i could protect my fishers. The main trouble with barbarian is it didnt migrate or invade, or change plan.
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Re: Brainless beating Barbie (hardest 1v1)

Postby  Brainless » Fri May 02, 2014 1:41 am

Brainless vs Barbie 2.14b hardest
AOC UP 1.4
1v1, map Savanah, explored

This is how you should not handle barbie: trush, then archers.
It looks like unfair play, because its becomes obviously totally chaotic.
But if you dont, you loose. However i have played vs earlier versions where vills acted more alert when in send mine between them. KEEP CALM and get rid of that mess, a little bit more of that? These vills make me think of a flock of sheep being held together by sheperd dogs..
Anyway i think i lost a vill + 2 archers, it puts up a fight in the end
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Attachment: Brainless vs Barbie - Hardest 1v1 Savannah.mgz.zip
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Re: Brainless beating Barbie (hardest 1v1)

Postby  TheMax » Fri May 02, 2014 10:34 am

Whether the villagers react to your forward builders is determined by town-size, which hasn't been touched; you were just slightly outside of it. The one-tile pathfinding issue unfortunately prevented the m@a from clearing low-hp house around the tower.

I'll test if expanding town size against detected forward would help. Building own tower with multiple villagers to prevent the enemy tower from going up would be the best option, but the game engine prevents that from happening, since it doesn't let placing anything in the range of the enemy tower (even if it isn't up yet). UP has improved the possibilities AIs have against forward towers, but they still remain very nasty.
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Re: Brainless beating Barbie (hardest 1v1)

Postby  Brainless » Wed May 07, 2014 2:23 pm

...
Last edited by  Brainless on Wed May 07, 2014 2:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Brainless beating Barbie (hardest 1v1)

Postby  Brainless » Wed May 07, 2014 2:24 pm

Brainless vs Barbie 2.14b hardest
AOC UP 1.4
1v1, map Blue Arabia, not explored

A dire situation: dark age starvation. No sheep, deer, fish or boar, just one single berry bush.
It forced me to do strict priority management: build farms, not lumbercamp until i could keep up the vill production.
Hence, a late feudal time
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Attachment: Brainless vs Barbie hardest Blue Arabia.zip
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Re: Brainless beating Barbie (hardest 1v1)

Postby  TheMax » Thu May 08, 2014 4:35 pm

Oh wow, Barbarian's dark age was absolutely terrible, it was only saved by the fact hardest cheats. I must improve playing on blue arabia.

Against that forward castle there isn't much to do since it failed to see the castle before it was up, and then you quickly blocked the access to wood.
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Re: Brainless beating Barbie (hardest 1v1)

Postby  Brainless » Fri May 09, 2014 11:33 am

  08 May 2014, 15:35 GMT » TheMax wrote:
Oh wow, Barbarian's dark age was absolutely terrible, it was only saved by the fact hardest cheats. I must improve playing on blue arabia.

Against that forward castle there isn't much to do since it failed to see the castle before it was up, and then you quickly blocked the access to wood.


Actually... i must confess i do not post my losses vs barbie here.
I lost the 1st one in this map. Barbie put a castle on me, while i tried knight rush. I tried 2nd time, restarting game, same map. So i had advantage knowing the map. So i copied barbie this time. The strange thing is, it does not copy itself in 2 identical situations. It changes strategy, sometimes it wins, sometimes it does not, because mostly bad luck i think?
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Re: Brainless beating Barbie (hardest 1v1)

Postby  TheMax » Fri May 09, 2014 4:59 pm

Flush detection might have triggered and switched the strategy, since most times AIs do the same strategy on restart (since they usually generate same random numbers).

Barbarian's strategy is partly random. It initially loads something and then may switch the strategy if it thinks that doesn't suit the situation (like flush -> FC as pocket or FC -> flush if detected enemy flush).
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